Build Fishing: Airs and Anti-Arts

Just as the title says, I'm looking for builds. First, I'm looking for a good, solid air bot, preferably UC (RT shop negotiable) that I can use both to take on Vanguards, MBGs, and all the what-have-you melee lands that are all too common, as well as hold my own against AGs, Scrims, Feng Meis, and...well, that's basically all the airs I see on a regular basis. You can count on me being more skilled than my opponents, but not by enough to make up for a difference in bot power through skill alone; this build needs some actual advantages I can (ab)use. Please, no hoppers or alpha-striking builds. Also, the build needs to be able to survive an occasional brush with an art or two, as well as the general "missiles everywhere" that the skies of CB have become.

Secondly, I need a good anti-art. Again, either UC or cheap shop RT, and it needs to be something nice and solid; nothing gimmicky. Preferably, it's be cheaper than the arts I'm hunting (mostly EVEs, Albas, and Mialys), and it needs to be able to get in and survive long enough to actually take out an art or two. While I'm open to melee lands, I'd really prefer something ranged.

For both these builds, I'm looking for something that can be built on a budget; while I can tune, I don't have access to loads and loads of tuning materials, and all slotted parts basically need to be easily obtained, as I do not have access to slot protectors. Also, please, no gimmicky builds; no Seraphs, no one-trick bots, etc. I'm looking for something I can be proud in, not something that I feel guilty about using. Basically, ask yourself if Alpherior would like the build; if he'd rage at it, it's probably not going to fly with me. I know I might be demanding the impossible here, and if I am, I'm willing to negotiate certain build points (for example, I'm willing to field two airs, one as an air superiority and one as a ground-attack).

http://www.cosmicbreakfanforum.com/t5828-uc-accel-saber-build

This is good.

Brickgale with ABR and mini zook lands me in top 5 easily without too much effort

butterflea bd has 18 fly if that helps you out

your speed can certainly help you GTFO if you see any arts

http://www.cosmicbreakfanforum.com/t5443-lxe-s-butterflea-build-development-project

I made this a while back when I started to learn how to build bots.

Gywain with SDC, that is about it

Accel Saber with Rocket Launcher and Negatron Rifle is pretty good. The only problem is Seraphs.
Also, with that setup you don't need to play as hopper. You still pick up short boost to move around and dodge some fire, but you actually use it to dodge, unlike hoppers that you use it because how much of a fag they are (stand still, and notice how they keep "dodging" non existent enemy fire).
Well, changing the Rocket Launcher for a zooka isn't bad either.
I Basically use it mostly as a defender bot, with occasional offensive runs.

(I got GW with that build while using Cyberoid HD and Big Head HDJ to make my hitbox even bigger and so be an easier target. Though the Cyberoid HD would break rather fast and I would survive the entire battle anyway. Just never really spammed that build because I didn't feel like properly tuning it. Loved to see this melee spammers with Geograsis pilebunker and the like falling from first to below the top 10, because that's how hard the Negatron Rifle hits them. XD)


About anti-art... If anything the easiest route would be getting Pulsardio. That 400 range subweapon can be a headache to arts. You are not killing them, but making them useless for a while.
Sometimes I would attack other arts with my Ganbura, but it's a gara bot, and not on gara now. D;

This thread sum up to me as

"can you abuse the power of an UC bot with minimal tuning?"

I have to say... No. Not that I know of.

If the question was "is there an UC bot that is [good enough] with minimal tuning?"

I would say, more often yes then no.

(i also feel this thread is a rant in disguise)

The main dish is the weapon. The bot is only the side dish. (bot with attached weapon make it a main dish; say mialy doesn't have her core weapon nor her WB... at that point no one would care about her aside her pantsu)

Good UC air weapon: limited plasma gun. A bot with really high tec will melt land.
Good UC anti-air weapon: most bazooka that achieve stun. A bot with really high tec will be air's nightmare (if there isn't too much difference in altitude height).

Everything else the bot can offer is just a bonus. Following that philosophy/theory, anyone can make a build that is "decent at killing things".
If your "skill" really is up to level, you should be able to avoid damage with minimal movement speed (and when you get a fast bot, with good damage, you become a beast); and hit things with minimal weapon speed/size.

And alpherior rage at everything. If you listen to everything he said, you should quit life. Because he will rage at your life too.

brickgale red's rifle is good.

LXE wrote:

http://www.cosmicbreakfanforum.com/t5828-uc-accel-saber-build

This is good.

Of course we need more retarded mindless hoppers in the game. Beautiful.

necrodrakath wrote:

LXE wrote:

http://www.cosmicbreakfanforum.com/t5828-uc-accel-saber-build

This is good.

Of course we need more retarded mindless hoppers in the game. Beautiful.

Little do you know the hoppers are smarter than you.

fhoeng wrote:

This thread sum up to me as

"can you abuse the power of an UC bot with minimal tuning?"

I have to say... No. Not that I know of.

If the question was "is there an UC bot that is [good enough] with minimal tuning?"

I would say, more often yes then no.

(i also feel this thread is a rant in disguise)

The main dish is the weapon. The bot is only the side dish. (bot with attached weapon make it a main dish; say mialy doesn't have her core weapon nor her WB... at that point no one would care about her aside her pantsu)

Good UC air weapon: limited plasma gun. A bot with really high tec will melt land.
Good UC anti-air weapon: most bazooka that achieve stun. A bot with really high tec will be air's nightmare (if there isn't too much difference in altitude height).

Everything else the bot can offer is just a bonus. Following that philosophy/theory, anyone can make a build that is "decent at killing things".
If your "skill" really is up to level, you should be able to avoid damage with minimal movement speed (and when you get a fast bot, with good damage, you become a beast); and hit things with minimal weapon speed/size.

And alpherior rage at everything. If you listen to everything he said, you should quit life. Because he will rage at your life too.

You're half-right about the rant; I find it impossible to get what I actually want across without veering into rant territory, such is the current CBEN meta. Your "dish" metaphor is also pretty spot-on; I tend to default to WBG as my primary air weapon (both cheaper than LPG and, I find, easier to hit with, plus a larger ammo capacity leads to a generally more reliable gun). However, most of the commonly-seen RT bots are by themselves more attractive main dishes than just about any UC weapon around, and that's my main issue; I'm looking to dress-up a UC gun with side dishes to make it as attractive (or at least as nutritious) as most of the commonly-used Garabots.

As for your actual suggestions, I tend to prioritize mobility over power; perhaps I'll try reversing that with more expendable builds. However, for my needs, "decent" isn't good enough, as while I would like to think my skill is above-average (or was, back when CBEN could claim 300+ people online most of the time), but not good enough to turn decent into great.

LXE, I said specifically no hoppers. Not only do I highly dislike the idea of hopping up and down being useful for dodging bullets on a battlefield, my playstyle and skillset does not support hopping.

GiaCG: I've been trying that out with a decent amount of success. Honestly, though, the Negatron rifle just doesn't hit hard compared to all the powerful melee weapons I see around, and its DPS isn't particularly good due to a slow fire rate (though that is dependent on the target's toughness). I'd also like to switch in a shell weapon for dealing with arts, who'll have both beam and blast guard.

Quote :

Honestly, though, the Negatron rifle just doesn't hit hard compared to all the powerful melee weapons I see around

It's supposed to hit lnds, which happens to be good at it considering you are using a lnd as well.
If you are going to compare it with melee, which is the complete opposite, why are you asking for things to deal with melee and airs? Melee both then?
But no really, in case you didn't notice, the build isn't meant to excel at both, but it can do well despite the fact that you are fighting people that you usually wouldn't as much, with their weakness, and with a pretty fast bot on land.
Fight airs with more mobility than an art, fight lnds with an hard hitting weapon while on land, which in some maps or situations it's better than use an air to kill them (examples being tunnels and arts covering the sky with missiles that won't home as much to you since you are not flying).

DPS isn't the most important thing if you properly tune it, since it will allow you to survive longer, and so finish with good damage with good cost.
Of course you can make a rambot, have better DPS and have a bigger cost in the end.

Also, hard hitting melee can go over 100 damage. If you want DPS as good as that, then you just got a much smaller number of bots and weapons to look for.

If you want shell, some rifle wouldn't change much, but a mag would make the build completely different, since a mag won't allow you to attack from "safer" distances like the other 2 weapons.


Though a build like that ends up depending on what the enemy is using. Many melees? Screw arts, eat the melees. Many airs and melee? Who cares about arts? Eat those 2. Lots of arts? Switch to something else.
Think of it as a supporting bot. Of course you can be selfish, but the build can be pretty good at supporting your team, by stunning rambots (and some will die pretty fast if they are unlucky) and cause some trouble to airs by hitting them or force them to avoid your missiles/zooka (which can open opportunities for your team to shoot them down).



BTW, hopping isn't supposed to dodge bullets, it's supposed to throw off the aim correction.
Using short boost when people actually fire against you and so dodging the bullet is okay, but that's not what almost all hoppers do. If you don't love your BR, try to stand still and look at a hopper and don't fire a single bullet. Then move around a bit so it doesn't look like you are AFK. Most will probably keep jumping even though no one is firing against them.
Of course some will stop doing it once they know that you are doing it on purpose, others can't stop double clicking.



Anti-art (gara art that is so), ends up being either faggotry or melee, and melee with UC is... Meh. Or Pulsardio. You won't kill them, but make them useless for a while.

Klinkin wrote:

LXE, I said specifically no hoppers. Not only do I highly dislike the idea of hopping up and down being useful for dodging bullets on a battlefield, my playstyle and skillset does not support hopping.

Learn to hop, it's one of the things you must learn in this game.

Klinkin wrote:

However, for my needs, "decent" isn't good enough, as while I would like to think my skill is above-average (or was, back when CBEN could claim 300+ people online most of the time), but not good enough to turn decent into great.

So basically... you want something at the same level as a tuned mialy from an UC bot with minimal tuning? (untuned mialy to me is just decent)

Your goal require divine intervention regardless of any game(task) you play(do).

That's like saying "I want to be better than the seasoned pro athlete without any experience."

May I suggest you to read some shoujo manga? Because main male character is almost always somehow ridiculous OP just because the author say so.

fhoeng wrote:

Klinkin wrote:

However, for my needs, "decent" isn't good enough, as while I would like to think my skill is above-average (or was, back when CBEN could claim 300+ people online most of the time), but not good enough to turn decent into great.

So basically... you want something at the same level as a tuned mialy from an UC bot with minimal tuning? (untuned mialy to me is just decent)

Your goal require divine intervention regardless of any game(task) you play(do).

That's like saying "I want to be better than the seasoned pro athlete without any experience."

May I suggest you to read some shoujo manga? Because main male character is almost always somehow ridiculous OP just because the author say so.

Is it unfair to want a UC bot on par with a Garabot with the same amount of tuning? You're acting like just because people sunk real money into this game they deserve better bots than players who play the game for free (a word which is prominently displayed on every single CB ad). I know I can't get a bot as good as a fully-tuned Garabot without fully tuning it myself, but I want a UC bot that, with minimal tuning, is as good as a Garabot with similarly minimal tuning.

GiaCG, I've been having more luck with that build recently; how would I add onto it past level 5? What carts would you recommend?

I never leveled mine past level 5, but mostly because when I used it I didn't feel like properly tuning it, yet.
Blast guard, Stun regain and short boost are the only carts besides capa carts.
Since I didn't actually use it as a hopper, I didn't pick quick land, since short boost is only there to dodge a few bullets/melee attacks and mostly to move around faster.
I actually don't remember which of my level 5 Accel sabers I used, if it was the all capa or the short boost one. I could go look for a screen that took from 1 of the first battles that I did to test it, but the problem is finding it. But considering how cost heave the rifle is and that I use a tuning Rocket Launcher, it probably was the all capa one.

And as seeing as some people say that "it's one of the things you must learn in this game", even without hopping it did really well. XD
At least it did much better than when I tested it with 5 weapons alpha striking. XD

Klinkin wrote:

fhoeng wrote:

Klinkin wrote:

However, for my needs, "decent" isn't good enough, as while I would like to think my skill is above-average (or was, back when CBEN could claim 300+ people online most of the time), but not good enough to turn decent into great.

So basically... you want something at the same level as a tuned mialy from an UC bot with minimal tuning? (untuned mialy to me is just decent)

Your goal require divine intervention regardless of any game(task) you play(do).

That's like saying "I want to be better than the seasoned pro athlete without any experience."

May I suggest you to read some shoujo manga? Because main male character is almost always somehow ridiculous OP just because the author say so.

Is it unfair to want a UC bot on par with a Garabot with the same amount of tuning? You're acting like just because people sunk real money into this game they deserve better bots than players who play the game for free (a word which is prominently displayed on every single CB ad). I know I can't get a bot as good as a fully-tuned Garabot without fully tuning it myself, but I want a UC bot that, with minimal tuning, is as good as a Garabot with similarly minimal tuning.

GiaCG, I've been having more luck with that build recently; how would I add onto it past level 5? What carts would you recommend?

They sacrificed more time (tuning) and money (PREMIUM gara bot) to get above the decent line, and you want to sacrifice less than them and receive same/better reward than them? YES, people who sunk more money and more time into this game DO deserve better than someone who sunk less money and less time.

If you want something better, you better be able to make up and surpass what they (people you want to beat) have already sacrificed. Whether it be directly on the same subject, or indirectly via other subject.

fhoeng wrote:

[They sacrificed more time (tuning) and money (PREMIUM gara bot) to get above the decent line, and you want to sacrifice less than them and receive same/better reward than them? YES, people who sunk more money and more time into this game DO deserve better than someone who sunk less money and less time.

If you want something better, you better be able to make up and surpass what they (people you want to beat) have already sacrificed. Whether it be directly on the same subject, or indirectly via other subject.

See, the time thing I'm fine with, and I can accept not having as highly tuned a bot simply because I don't play as much, but not money. I don;t care how much someone has sunk into a game, they should not have an in-game advantage because they spent more money. That's not just my opinion, that's the opinion of basically every well-known game review/commentary group, and that's the last I'm going to say on that topic to keep this thread from derailing.

GiaCG, would you recommend taking both short boost and boost run since the frequency of the short-boosting will be significantly lower than a hopper (perhaps in conjunction with quick boost)?

Klinkin wrote:

fhoeng wrote:

[They sacrificed more time (tuning) and money (PREMIUM gara bot) to get above the decent line, and you want to sacrifice less than them and receive same/better reward than them? YES, people who sunk more money and more time into this game DO deserve better than someone who sunk less money and less time.

If you want something better, you better be able to make up and surpass what they (people you want to beat) have already sacrificed. Whether it be directly on the same subject, or indirectly via other subject.

See, the time thing I'm fine with, and I can accept not having as highly tuned a bot simply because I don't play as much, but not money. I don;t care how much someone has sunk into a game, they should not have an in-game advantage because they spent more money. That's not just my opinion, that's the opinion of basically every well-known game review/commentary group, and that's the last I'm going to say on that topic to keep this thread from derailing.

GiaCG, would you recommend taking both short boost and boost run since the frequency of the short-boosting will be significantly lower than a hopper (perhaps in conjunction with quick boost)?

I prefered it without boost run.
I rarely ever use boost run. I only actively use it on my Kuten, but that's because it's melee and I got high tier boost run with her.
Boost run on that Accel build... I dunno if it would hurt the Negatron Rifle accuracy. If it didn't... Then I would try to make it pretty fast, but if it was to stay below red tier, then I'd rather use it without boost run, because I prefer consistency (without boost run I can run without stops).
Also, won't it hurt when you want to shoot airs over you? Lnds doesn't have the wide range that arts have, and boost run will cut a bit more of that range over you I think.