Vanguard OP or not?

Just want to hear what you guy think. There's a long story behind this Q but no nid to say i guess.

Top-tier, but not god-tier.

God-tier is reserved for REALLY gamebreaking stuff

Depends on the user.

if they can close enough, they are OP...
depend on build, player, and enemies too
even average player know when to stay away from them

I'm asking abt the bot itself in general btw.

nope, no melee OP imo
*cuz I always play fast bot so they rarely able to reach me anyway, unless got backstabed ofcourse*.
they are TOP in their class ofcourse

No

vanguards can be in various roles depending on what carts you get and how you tune them.

for example, he's an awesome assassin (ambush) with a broad radar, rambo with grappler tunes + boost run, he can utilize Slow tunes very well, he can have benefits out of hopping and Accele Roll TREMENDOUSLY if you are committed in tuning him FLY.

I think he's pretty much OP rather thanks to his utility than his melee combo. (i meant damage)

Well, let me put it this way:

I was able to solo a Vanguard with my "barely breaking double digits mobility" fat ART once, and I was within his attack range during most of the fight. This becomes much more telling when you realize I'm a mediocre player at best. If the bot were remotely OP, even in the hands of a literal newb, I should have been beaten, no contest.

just had a long discussion in VNS forumabout this topic


There are not so many MELEE bot can beat this guy

in my view when compare Vanguard...
to the general melee bots: OP
to the higher tier melee bots: Top-class

the build ways also make some differences. but when sum up, they all are top tier in the melee village

No.

I look in here, I see people bashing Vanguard trio

the vanguards are excellent, I have played all three types, allow me to describe the weaknesses and strengths

Lancer:
Pros - Long reach, good combo in overdrive
Cons - lack of overdrive ammo, gap between combos, last attack in overdrive is a long charge,
should never be used without overdrive (Reg combo is too slow)

Axer:
Pros - Long reach, fast combo regardless of overdrive, fast attacker, can hit AIR rather easy
Cons - Not very mobile, not used enough to be notable

Fencer:
Pros - Mobile, fast ground combo, overdrive is helpful but not needed.
Cons - No air combo (only a jump slash), Sword is shortest of all vanguard weapons

All three also suffer from a bit of "gangbang-itis" when a group sees a vanguard, they ALL aim for it.

Whenever I'm an air or gunner lnd I target vanguards. They're easy as fuck to kill, as long as they don't hit you.

Of course, as an air I tend to respect Axer's range and keep my distance. As a gunner lnd, Fencer's the biggest problem of the three due to its ability to have a wide swing in overdrive.

Vanguards are good even in not quite for arena configurations.

But as usual, vanguards should stay away from melee laggers.

axer is high tier. Melee builds can only reach high tier

fencer is mid tier.

lancer is shit tier.

Turkeysaur wrote:

Vanguards are good even in not quite for arena configurations.

But as usual, vanguards should stay away from melee laggers.

Yeah. D;

I've killed MBG without their armor without any problem, but the lagging ones? Lol no.
Before I could land the third hit with my Lancer with power gain, I was stunned because the second or even both first and second didn't register.
But that goes for any bot anyway.

(like my K-sword bots to fool around on level 5 rooms since they aren't even tuned. I could fight everyone, except this one BR, because my K-Sword attacks would go through his Hati and while I was attacking, he would twitch and then hit me with a Kamui. >_> And yes, he actually was a BR.)

Back to Vanguards. It's pretty annoying how Fencer and Axer deal so much damage in 1 hit.
And since the only melee that I actually like to use, even though it happens to be a easy bot to use, uses a high tier boost run, I have trouble using melee without boost run or with boost run that isn't as high as my Kuten (I did said that it was easy to use. I wanted Ouka, but oh well, I have to use Kuten instead).
But that's because I never practiced enough, and with the game running slower and slower...

With Lancer I had really nice battles, but sometimes he would derp way too much, or lagtinos would invade the enemy team and soon I was being stunned during my combos when I was attacking them from behind.
I actually never finished my Lancer, though I only need to do 1 more tune to finish. (Maybe I will have to retune some parts some day, since I changed the last tune and there will be more free capa for tough, but I don't have any free slots. Yes, I tuned them ALL except 1 for the last tune, and I had to use Thoarla LG.)
My Lancer doesn't have such tunes like CV or any weapon tunes, it's simply stat tuned. 40str, 36 wlk (with the last tune, was going for 38) and 29tgh (might get more with a few changes later).

In the end, and even though I never got any of the other 2 Vanguards, for me Lancer is a nice bot, that can deal and screw up arts pretty well (sometimes other bots, even airs sometimes get stuck against a wall), but you need some brains to use him, or you won't score as much as his attacks aren't as strong, though the whole combo can take a big chunk.
The major problem is how useless Lancer is without Power Gain. The damage isn't bad, but the attack is so damn slow that you rarely hit anything, besides trees and botters. (well, you can hit cacti just fine too)

Ritter BS + Axer is cancer.

Otherwise no.

My para tuned DBMG makes short work of Vanguards.

Mew wrote:

Ritter BS + Axer is cancer.

Otherwise no.

My para tuned DBMG makes short work of Vanguards.

you are a dumb ass

Nou

Try it out. It's fucking amazing.

It hits Seraphs as well.

Mew wrote:

Nou

Try it out. It's fucking amazing.

It hits Seraphs as well.

Your bragging about killing a land with a air

Which is trying to disaprove how it's not OP? Why so retarded Miki =(?

But to elaborate on my previous point.

Ritter BS will launch you high in the air and kill AIRs with serious ease.

boytitan2 wrote:

Mew wrote:

Nou

Try it out. It's fucking amazing.

It hits Seraphs as well.

Your bragging about killing a land with a air

he's killing airs with a land. learn to reading comprehension.

Malphes wrote:

boytitan2 wrote:

Mew wrote:

Nou

Try it out. It's fucking amazing.

It hits Seraphs as well.

Your bragging about killing a land with a air

he's killing airs with a land. learn to reading comprehension.

WAIT JUST A MINUTE OF here,Mew and maplhes you niggas no read im talking about your dbmg killing lands thats a given >_<

silly titties can't read.

Back to topic, as long as your team have some decent airs they should be able to control the damage vanguard can do. Axer is the only one that can hit airs consistently, and even then only if the air doesn't take off from a higher ground.

OP is a matter of opinion. Depending on where you stand.

If a LND is breaking the rock, paper, scissors chain with VERY LITTLE ease then, it is OP.

EVE does not count. She isn't easy mode.