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 Game Randomly Freezing

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AzureRathalos
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PostSubject: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyThu Mar 03, 2016 11:56 pm

I'm posting this here to try and get some help. A friend of mine wants to get back into CB for a 3rd person shooter fix, however the game is randomly locking up on him and taking long periods of time to load. When watching the CPU and GPU usage on the laptop, neither go up very much. I can't help but feel that the game doesn't seem to be using as much processing power as it could be using.

His computer's stats are as follows:
- HP Pavilion 17
- AMD A8-5550M Quad-Core Processor (2.1 GHz) (Intel Equivalent is about i5)
- 8 GB RAM
- Windows 8.1 x64
- AMD Radeon HD 8550g

What we've already tried:
- Set Memory Usage to M (Freezing increased from the original setting of L.)
- Set Memory Usage to XL (Freezing increased from the original setting of L.)
- Set Memory Usage to L (Seems to be the sweet spot for this machine)
- Set Max Objects to halfway on the bar. (Makes a bit of a difference.)

If anyone has some suggestions of things to try, it would be greatly appreciated.
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Kuzuha
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyFri Mar 04, 2016 12:52 am

Did he tweak the GPU settings of the vidcard? If so, try playing the game on default settings.
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wapiti4
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyFri Mar 11, 2016 4:31 am

While I haven't faced the issue myself, since you haven't said you touched everything in the options menu, there's some stuff I would suggest doing. I'll paste a pic below on how my settings look like.

https://i.servimg.com/u/f84/18/47/79/97/opshen10.png

To begin, I'd say trying to change the ever-mysterious Performance option to High if it wasn't already, or maybe if it's already at High, Low might work too.Disabling the Optimize Resolution sounds good to me too, or lower the antialiasing to 2x. That's pretty much what I think would help, and hopefully it does. Maybe setting priority as a final thing to do is good too.
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Hellshake Yano
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyFri Mar 11, 2016 4:51 am

i have that too :/
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Skulkraken
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyFri Mar 11, 2016 8:02 am

Old XP-era programs like Cosmic Break lack the ability to access more than 2GB of RAM by default.  The program available from this link can manually set the Windows flag needed for the game to access the rest of the RAM in your system.  The exe you need to edit is the one in the game's /programs subdirectory.
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God is a Cat Girl
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyFri Mar 11, 2016 1:25 pm

@Skulkraken wrote:
Old XP-era programs like Cosmic Break lack the ability to access more than 2GB of RAM by default.  The program available from this link can manually set the Windows flag needed for the game to access the rest of the RAM in your system.  The exe you need to edit is the one in the game's /programs subdirectory.

That's a 32-bit problem that only happens after playing for a long period of time, and it doesn't just freeze or take longer to load, it locks up after around 3 hard locks. Even today there's still new games running at 32-bit which later are forced to use 64-bit because the game starts dying as it keeps growing.

The game itself isn't optimized and has the performance of a 5000 years old mummy working in a construction site carrying bags of cement.
Not to mention certain options being bugged to hell and not functioning correctly.
CS is like a kid that never cleans his/her room, they just keep throwing more stuff into the room and doesn't organize it, so every time they want to find a toy they have to dive into the pile of shit to find it, which is plagued with trash and broken shit that should've been thrown away.


GPU settings will barely do anything for the game, because the game barely uses the GPU, and only things like V-sync will change anything, not because of the game but because of what V-sync itself does.

Also, the game can't make proper use of multi cores, so it tends to run like shit in multi-core setups that have low frequency in each core (the game would run a million times better if they fixed this).
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Skulkraken
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyFri Mar 11, 2016 10:07 pm

@God is a Cat Girl wrote:
@Skulkraken wrote:
Old XP-era programs like Cosmic Break lack the ability to access more than 2GB of RAM by default.  The program available from this link can manually set the Windows flag needed for the game to access the rest of the RAM in your system.  The exe you need to edit is the one in the game's /programs subdirectory.

That's a 32-bit problem that only happens after playing for a long period of time, and it doesn't just freeze or take longer to load, it locks up after around 3 hard locks. Even today there's still new games running at 32-bit which later are forced to use 64-bit because the game starts dying as it keeps growing.

The game itself isn't optimized and has the performance of a 5000 years old mummy working in a construction site carrying bags of cement.
Not to mention certain options being bugged to hell and not functioning correctly.
CS is like a kid that never cleans his/her room, they just keep throwing more stuff into the room and doesn't organize it, so every time they want to find a toy they have to dive into the pile of shit to find it, which is plagued with trash and broken shit that should've been thrown away.


GPU settings will barely do anything for the game, because the game barely uses the GPU, and only things like V-sync will change anything, not because of the game but because of what V-sync itself does.

Also, the game can't make proper use of multi cores, so it tends to run like shit in multi-core setups that have low frequency in each core (the game would run a million times better if they fixed this).

It's still a good idea for him to look into making the program Large Address Aware. The "video card" he named is actually an integrated graphics chip, meaning that it uses the system's RAM as its video memory. If part of the 2GB block of RAM available to the game were to fall anywhere within the memory block used by the Radeon chip, it could very easily lead to the intermittent problems he's seeing.

The version of Java CB uses actually does support both GPUs and multithreading/multicore CPUs, but the features are turned off by default since they're rarely used.
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AzureRathalos
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyFri Mar 11, 2016 10:33 pm

Status update:
Kuzuha's suggestion - Put the GPU settings to default (So everything is set to application-controlled) and the freezing significantly lowered (but still enough to disrupt gameplay). The thing is, we have no idea what settings CB tells the GPU to use.

Skulkraken - Hmmm... Interesting. I'll have my friend try that out later. I'll report the results after testing.

My friend's game settings are:

Screen
Show names - ON
Fixed radar - OFF
Receive backup requests - ON
Lock on text - OFF
Display attack name - ON
Garage banners - ON

Sound
Doesn't matter.

System
Memory size - L (Seems to be the sweet spot on his machine)
Thread optimization - ON

Graphics
Display - Window
Performance - Low
Stage shadows - ON (Tried OFF, didn't make a difference.)
Max objects - Half way. (Too low and you'll end up having to deal with things like invisible bullets.)
Hide skins - OFF
Screen size - 1280x720
Robot icon - Full body
Fix UI size - OFF
Wide screen - ON
Anti alias - OFF
Optimize resolution - OFF

UI Tutorial
Doesn't matter.
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God is a Cat Girl
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptySat Mar 12, 2016 1:22 am

@Skulkraken wrote:
@God is a Cat Girl wrote:
@Skulkraken wrote:
Old XP-era programs like Cosmic Break lack the ability to access more than 2GB of RAM by default.  The program available from this link can manually set the Windows flag needed for the game to access the rest of the RAM in your system.  The exe you need to edit is the one in the game's /programs subdirectory.

That's a 32-bit problem that only happens after playing for a long period of time, and it doesn't just freeze or take longer to load, it locks up after around 3 hard locks. Even today there's still new games running at 32-bit which later are forced to use 64-bit because the game starts dying as it keeps growing.

The game itself isn't optimized and has the performance of a 5000 years old mummy working in a construction site carrying bags of cement.
Not to mention certain options being bugged to hell and not functioning correctly.
CS is like a kid that never cleans his/her room, they just keep throwing more stuff into the room and doesn't organize it, so every time they want to find a toy they have to dive into the pile of shit to find it, which is plagued with trash and broken shit that should've been thrown away.


GPU settings will barely do anything for the game, because the game barely uses the GPU, and only things like V-sync will change anything, not because of the game but because of what V-sync itself does.

Also, the game can't make proper use of multi cores, so it tends to run like shit in multi-core setups that have low frequency in each core (the game would run a million times better if they fixed this).

It's still a good idea for him to look into making the program Large Address Aware.  The "video card" he named is actually an integrated graphics chip, meaning that it uses the system's RAM as its video memory.  If part of the 2GB block of RAM available to the game were to fall anywhere within the memory block used by the Radeon chip, it could very easily lead to the intermittent problems he's seeing.

The version of Java CB uses actually does support both GPUs and multithreading/multicore CPUs, but the features are turned off by default since they're rarely used.

Vram shouldn't interfere with the game unless the game was taking all the memory (which it won't since he has 8GB), as they should be 2 different processes, and the limitation is only for the application. I'd also consider that it wouldn't matter that much as CB barely uses the GPU (it wouldn't surprise me if that's also why it takes so much ram right now).

Yeah, CB wasn't really made with those things in mind, and CS just won't bother looking into them unless the game breaks and turn unplayable for everyone (which is only when they do something, like the memory options).
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Kuzuha
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptySat Mar 12, 2016 8:04 am

Is he using an SSD (solid state drive)? If he is, I'd suggest he installs CB in that drive. Or, if he has spare RAM (I have 8GB too), have him install the Radeon Ramdisk. Once he's done that, have him copy and paste CB in that RAM drive and play it from there (you may want to check how the app is used but it's not very hard, really). Remember that the game will be removed from the RAM drive every time he resets the computer (or maybe logging off).

I would strongly suggest that he has his Memory size set to M instead of L.
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Shidokun
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyTue Mar 15, 2016 6:00 am

I have a SSD and I dont see a huge difference for putting it in a SSD. The only thing I can see is that loads a little faster (not by much) and yet I still get those random frameskips of 0.5sec. No idea about ramdisk because thats even faster than a SSD.
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Kuzuha
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyTue Mar 15, 2016 7:47 am

It really depends on the specs of your pc. I noticed a big difference in performance after I installed an SSD. Of course, I have free ram as well so it really does help using a ramdrive if you don't want to overuse your SSD.
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AzureRathalos
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyMon Mar 21, 2016 4:24 pm

Kuzuha - No SSD.

Random Updates:

Changed "Graphics - Performance" to High and it greatly improved the loading time for the garage and the beginning of game rounds.

One thing I noticed when playing some rounds together is that some of his more sever game lockups coincide with times when I would get frame drops (and I, of course, have a better PC and faster internet than my friend).

Haven't tried Large Address Aware yet.

As another random test, we both installed CB2 and took it for a spin. The game consumes more resource than CB, but it ran better than CB did. It reinforces my assumption that something is capping or limiting CB somewhere...
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyTue Mar 22, 2016 6:44 pm

@AzureRathalos wrote:
It reinforces my assumption that something is capping or limiting CB somewhere...
Shitty code.
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Skulkraken
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyTue Mar 22, 2016 11:00 pm

@AzureRathalos wrote:
As another random test, we both installed CB2 and took it for a spin. The game consumes more resource than CB, but it ran better than CB did. It reinforces my assumption that something is capping or limiting CB somewhere...

You're seeing this because CB2 is already Large Address Aware by default.

Imagine your friend's RAM as a numbered series of 1GB chunks (I'm simplifying things for the sake of explanation).
When CB2 goes to put things into RAM, it sees this:
Code:
1GB 2GB 3GB 4GB 5GB 6GB 7GB 8GB
When CB1 goes to put things into RAM, it sees this:
Code:
1GB 2GB

CB, like other old-ass games, cannot count high enough on its own to get to the rest of the RAM, even though the other (newer) programs around it can.  The game will not make use of any other RAM besides those first two GB because it literally does not know it exists.  Instead, it'll start using the hard drive's page file if it needs more memory.  Which is slow as fuck if the hard drive isn't an SSD.
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God is a Cat Girl
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyTue Mar 22, 2016 11:52 pm

@Skulkraken wrote:
@AzureRathalos wrote:
As another random test, we both installed CB2 and took it for a spin. The game consumes more resource than CB, but it ran better than CB did. It reinforces my assumption that something is capping or limiting CB somewhere...

You're seeing this because CB2 is already Large Address Aware by default.

Imagine your friend's RAM as a numbered series of 1GB chunks (I'm simplifying things for the sake of explanation).
When CB2 goes to put things into RAM, it sees this:
Code:
1GB 2GB 3GB 4GB 5GB 6GB 7GB 8GB
When CB1 goes to put things into RAM, it sees this:
Code:
1GB 2GB

CB, like other old-ass games, cannot count high enough on its own to get to the rest of the RAM, even though the other (newer) programs around it can.  The game will not make use of any other RAM besides those first two GB because it literally does not know it exists.  Instead, it'll start using the hard drive's page file if it needs more memory.  Which is slow as fuck if the hard drive isn't an SSD.

Actually CB seems to freeze, completely, when it runs out of memory.

CB's problem isn't just ram, the ram issue only happens if you don't have much ram to start with or when it finally can't put in anymore and just dies, the code is what makes all the issues that he sees, this is been a problem since... always really. The game was never optimized and CS keeps throwing more and more shit at it, so the game just goes all over the place to get what it needs, and the code not being optimized results in the game continuously require more resources well over what it actually uses, to keep running smoothly. The has no actual reason for it's requirements besides the shitty code.

SSD and Ram programs are only a Clutch, you are only giving it access to data faster, so it doesn't have to stop to look for it (CB also freezes when fetching data, even if from the server, this is easily seen in the shop, it's mostly a java thing as games like Minecraft do the same exact thing), it's not that the game actually needs it, it's just that the code is shit.

If the game was optimized and maintained properly, this would go back running on really old dual core computers, because besides content, the game hasn't moved an inch anywhere that would actually require more resources.

If the problem was ram, everyone without a SSD would have it, which is not true.

There's also the issue that this game was made to run on shit like P4, it probably wasn't updated to handle newer CPU.
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Skulkraken
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyWed Mar 23, 2016 2:09 am

Blegh, I fucked up. The 2GB cap actually applies to both RAM and the page file...and 32bit programs like CB only get that cap raised to 4GB when large address aware.  Which might help, but not enough to get Azure"s friend the kind of performance boost he wants.  Go ahead and ignore my suggestion.  Embarassed
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyWed Mar 23, 2016 2:23 am

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AzureRathalos
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PostSubject: Re: Game Randomly Freezing   Game Randomly Freezing EmptyMon Apr 25, 2016 4:39 pm

@Skulkraken wrote:
Blegh, I fucked up. The 2GB cap actually applies to both RAM and the page file...and 32bit programs like CB only get that cap raised to 4GB when large address aware.  Which might help, but not enough to get Azure"s friend the kind of performance boost he wants.  Go ahead and ignore my suggestion.  Embarassed

It's been a while since I made a reply. My friend hasn't been available to try out CB in a while.

Skulkraken, we gave Large Address Aware a shot and the results were very strange. (I would test it on my own PC to compare, but my game works fine and I'd like to not risk breaking it) When LAA was enabled to cosmic.exe, it should have allowed more memory usage. INSTEAD, the program did not use any more than 1GB of RAM. Performance went down as the resources were somehow capped even further. After removing the LAA setting from cosmic.exe, the game began using more RAM than it did before the attempt.

It seems as if applying and removing the LAA settings has fixed some of the memory usage limitations. My friend can play Legion rounds without much issue now, but he still has issues in full Arena.
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